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	<title>Comments on: Grand Theft Auto IV: Boycott or Buy?</title>
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	<description>Where the Christian Faith Meets March Madness</description>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.christandpopculture.com/games/grand-theft-auto-iv-boycott-or-buy/#comment-8197</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 23:32:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.christandpopculture.com/?p=555#comment-8197</guid>
		<description>This is a very interesting viewpoint. I was happy to see that somebody could rise above all the negativity this game receives and recognize the GTA series for what it is: video games. It is not real life, and for those that can recognize that, I would recommend GTA IV as a very well made, fun to play game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a very interesting viewpoint. I was happy to see that somebody could rise above all the negativity this game receives and recognize the GTA series for what it is: video games. It is not real life, and for those that can recognize that, I would recommend GTA IV as a very well made, fun to play game.</p>
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		<title>By: The Dane</title>
		<link>http://www.christandpopculture.com/games/grand-theft-auto-iv-boycott-or-buy/#comment-1836</link>
		<dc:creator>The Dane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Apr 2008 13:38:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.christandpopculture.com/?p=555#comment-1836</guid>
		<description>I presume John&#039;s &lt;b&gt;for&lt;/b&gt; the series. Because if people lining up to purchase the game pre-release says anything, it bespeaks the level of gaming excellence people have come to expect from the &lt;i&gt;GTA&lt;/i&gt; franchise. And I suppose that making a good game and selling it at a good price is worthy of &lt;i&gt;some&lt;/i&gt; praise. As well, John is clearly reserving at least &lt;i&gt;some&lt;/i&gt; thought for the series as well.

So despite the cryptic comment: Welcome John, it&#039;s good to have you on board.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I presume John&#8217;s <b>for</b> the series. Because if people lining up to purchase the game pre-release says anything, it bespeaks the level of gaming excellence people have come to expect from the <i>GTA</i> franchise. And I suppose that making a good game and selling it at a good price is worthy of <i>some</i> praise. As well, John is clearly reserving at least <i>some</i> thought for the series as well.</p>
<p>So despite the cryptic comment: Welcome John, it&#8217;s good to have you on board.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.christandpopculture.com/games/grand-theft-auto-iv-boycott-or-buy/#comment-1835</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Apr 2008 12:06:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.christandpopculture.com/?p=555#comment-1835</guid>
		<description>Philippians 4:8 
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.

&lt;em&gt;John&#039;s last blog post..&lt;a href=&#039;http://deadtheologian.wordpress.com/2008/04/23/extraordinary-ministry-by-an-ordinary-pastor-pt-3/&#039; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Extraordinary Ministry by an “Ordinary Pastor” (Pt 3)&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Philippians 4:8<br />
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.</p>
<p><em>John&#8217;s last blog post..<a href='http://deadtheologian.wordpress.com/2008/04/23/extraordinary-ministry-by-an-ordinary-pastor-pt-3/' rel="nofollow">Extraordinary Ministry by an “Ordinary Pastor” (Pt 3)</a></em></p>
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		<title>By: Alyssa</title>
		<link>http://www.christandpopculture.com/games/grand-theft-auto-iv-boycott-or-buy/#comment-1834</link>
		<dc:creator>Alyssa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 21:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.christandpopculture.com/?p=555#comment-1834</guid>
		<description>Oh come on, birthday parties and fluffy animals? There&#039;s nothing to fear. Check out the previews: http://www.236.com/news/2008/04/28/gta_iv_grander_theftier_autoie_6138.php</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh come on, birthday parties and fluffy animals? There&#8217;s nothing to fear. Check out the previews: <a href="http://www.236.com/news/2008/04/28/gta_iv_grander_theftier_autoie_6138.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.236.com/news/2008/04/28/gta_iv_grander_theftier_autoie_6138.php</a></p>
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		<title>By: The Dane</title>
		<link>http://www.christandpopculture.com/games/grand-theft-auto-iv-boycott-or-buy/#comment-1807</link>
		<dc:creator>The Dane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 15:37:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.christandpopculture.com/?p=555#comment-1807</guid>
		<description>Because its so very apropos, I&#039;m duplicating my comments from &lt;a href=&quot;/games/mommy-what-is-that-alien-doing/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the &lt;i&gt;Mass Effects&lt;/i&gt; post&lt;/a&gt;.
________________________________________________

My wife walked in a couple years back while I was meandering around the digital sandbox that is &lt;i&gt;Grand theft Auto: San Andreas&lt;/i&gt; and was horrified that I stopped an old lady on a motorcross bike, kicked her in the face to knock her off, stole her bike and then accidentally ran over her while trying to drive away. As the pool of digital red began to spread under her fallen form and a couple wads of cash began to appear around her, my wife goggled, not really sure what to say. &quot;Wow. That’s horrible.&quot;

She is not the kind of person who should be playing something like &lt;i&gt;GTA:SA&lt;/i&gt;.

What is the difference between her and I? Neither of us remotely support violence or theft. The thought that something like the game scenario I just described actually takes place on occasion in the real world sickens me. I’m not violent. I’m not prone to theft. I don’t rejoice in iniquity. And neither does she. And yet I don’t have any moral compunction about driving a camper into a crowd milling about a plaza in San Fiero or shooting a surface-to-air missile into my ex-girlfriend’s car in Los Santos. Why is that?

I think it’s because the two of us are observing different things going on in the games space. Where she sees me, her husband, stomping on a woman until she dies, I see little more than a game mechanic.* I have never really been able to identify with the roles presented me in games. The term role-playing game has always been a bit of a joke when applied to video games.** I was not a plumber crawling through pipes to find a mushroom where there ought to have been a princess. I was not an elfish fellow hunting for Tri-Force. I was not trapped on the isle of Myst or Riven or even J’nanin. I was not Gordon Freeman. I was not even Thedane or Cossarwal, adventurers in the land of Azeroth.

And I am not CJ, stealing cars, killing hookers, and decimating the state’s law enforcement legions.

In fact, there is no God or morality in the realms where those concepts (Mario, Link, etc.) dwell. There is only the mechanic. Those who can see that can play games like these without fear for their soul’s well-being. Those who can’t, those who empathize with the mechanic as if they were actually people, shouldn’t touch the stuff. It’s a matter of self-awareness and self-honesty.
________________________________________________

And now, more directly to your point here, while I&#039;m not rushing out to get the game at launch (I have a hard time justifying $60 for a videogame, no matter how awesome), I&#039;ll probably end up getting it eventually&#8212;probably when it&#039;s lost its sheen and is selling at Target for nineteen bucks. And the reason I&#039;ll get it is pretty simply this: it looks like an awesome game.

All the sundry reasons that people would reasonably boycott the game are good and fine when applied to their individual consciences, but as I related in the story above regarding &lt;i&gt;GTA IV&lt;/i&gt;&#039;s predecessor, I just don&#039;t process game violence on anything near a level as I would real violence. I personally have a hard time imagining myself being affected by the moralities played out within the scope of the virtual environment in any real way. 

In a sense, this conversation winds back to Carissa&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;/literature/forgiving-willoughby/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a couple weeks back&lt;/a&gt; when she explored the idea of whether it was necessary to forgive Willoughby. The ability to divorce the imaginary from the real is, I think, one of the higher functions of the human experience.*** The power of a story is to draw you into its world, but the power of the mind is to recognize the fact that the story is a fiction and the happenings of that world just your imagination.

So yes, I&#039;ll likely get &lt;i&gt;GTA IV&lt;/i&gt;, play it, and enjoy it, despite the fact that it both proffers an inadequate social commentary and presents its pitiable, sinful protagonist in such a way that his murderous actions are fun. And I&#039;ll do so, because I was relying on neither of those concepts to justify my playing of the game. I had no need to justify my playing of the game at all (at least not to myself).
________________________________________________

As far as the list of complaints that included &quot;The game is a cop killing simulator,&quot; it may be that I&#039;ve only played &lt;i&gt;San Andreas&lt;/i&gt;, but I haven&#039;t seen anything like &quot;You can sleep with a prostitute and then beat her to get your money back&quot; or &quot;You can drive drunk, and it’s fun.&quot; I&#039;ve given rides to protitutes, taking them from job to job and prtecting them from violent clients, but if you &lt;i&gt;can&lt;/i&gt; have sex with them in the game, it&#039;s not immediately apparent how. And I can&#039;t even begin to imagine how to drive drunk in the game. As far as partial nudity goes, I guess there was a nudie bar wear the girls wore bikinis... not that I can imagine how one might find videogame girls enticing&#8212;but we live in a very strange world, so anything&#039;s possible I guess.
________________________________________________

NOTES:
*the little more that I see is related to visual interests.

**see Escapist Magazine’s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_30/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;thirtieth issue&lt;/a&gt; for a decent treatment of this - and especially John Tynes’ &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_30/183-The-Contrarian-Masks-in-the-Woods&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&quot;Masks in the Woods.&quot;&lt;/a&gt;

***not that I&#039;m saying I am Awesome for being able to do this. It&#039;s just something that comes with a lot of practice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because its so very apropos, I&#8217;m duplicating my comments from <a href="/games/mommy-what-is-that-alien-doing/" rel="nofollow">the <i>Mass Effects</i> post</a>.<br />
________________________________________________</p>
<p>My wife walked in a couple years back while I was meandering around the digital sandbox that is <i>Grand theft Auto: San Andreas</i> and was horrified that I stopped an old lady on a motorcross bike, kicked her in the face to knock her off, stole her bike and then accidentally ran over her while trying to drive away. As the pool of digital red began to spread under her fallen form and a couple wads of cash began to appear around her, my wife goggled, not really sure what to say. &#8220;Wow. That’s horrible.&#8221;</p>
<p>She is not the kind of person who should be playing something like <i>GTA:SA</i>.</p>
<p>What is the difference between her and I? Neither of us remotely support violence or theft. The thought that something like the game scenario I just described actually takes place on occasion in the real world sickens me. I’m not violent. I’m not prone to theft. I don’t rejoice in iniquity. And neither does she. And yet I don’t have any moral compunction about driving a camper into a crowd milling about a plaza in San Fiero or shooting a surface-to-air missile into my ex-girlfriend’s car in Los Santos. Why is that?</p>
<p>I think it’s because the two of us are observing different things going on in the games space. Where she sees me, her husband, stomping on a woman until she dies, I see little more than a game mechanic.* I have never really been able to identify with the roles presented me in games. The term role-playing game has always been a bit of a joke when applied to video games.** I was not a plumber crawling through pipes to find a mushroom where there ought to have been a princess. I was not an elfish fellow hunting for Tri-Force. I was not trapped on the isle of Myst or Riven or even J’nanin. I was not Gordon Freeman. I was not even Thedane or Cossarwal, adventurers in the land of Azeroth.</p>
<p>And I am not CJ, stealing cars, killing hookers, and decimating the state’s law enforcement legions.</p>
<p>In fact, there is no God or morality in the realms where those concepts (Mario, Link, etc.) dwell. There is only the mechanic. Those who can see that can play games like these without fear for their soul’s well-being. Those who can’t, those who empathize with the mechanic as if they were actually people, shouldn’t touch the stuff. It’s a matter of self-awareness and self-honesty.<br />
________________________________________________</p>
<p>And now, more directly to your point here, while I&#8217;m not rushing out to get the game at launch (I have a hard time justifying $60 for a videogame, no matter how awesome), I&#8217;ll probably end up getting it eventually&#8212;probably when it&#8217;s lost its sheen and is selling at Target for nineteen bucks. And the reason I&#8217;ll get it is pretty simply this: it looks like an awesome game.</p>
<p>All the sundry reasons that people would reasonably boycott the game are good and fine when applied to their individual consciences, but as I related in the story above regarding <i>GTA IV</i>&#8217;s predecessor, I just don&#8217;t process game violence on anything near a level as I would real violence. I personally have a hard time imagining myself being affected by the moralities played out within the scope of the virtual environment in any real way. </p>
<p>In a sense, this conversation winds back to Carissa&#8217;s <a href="/literature/forgiving-willoughby/" rel="nofollow">a couple weeks back</a> when she explored the idea of whether it was necessary to forgive Willoughby. The ability to divorce the imaginary from the real is, I think, one of the higher functions of the human experience.*** The power of a story is to draw you into its world, but the power of the mind is to recognize the fact that the story is a fiction and the happenings of that world just your imagination.</p>
<p>So yes, I&#8217;ll likely get <i>GTA IV</i>, play it, and enjoy it, despite the fact that it both proffers an inadequate social commentary and presents its pitiable, sinful protagonist in such a way that his murderous actions are fun. And I&#8217;ll do so, because I was relying on neither of those concepts to justify my playing of the game. I had no need to justify my playing of the game at all (at least not to myself).<br />
________________________________________________</p>
<p>As far as the list of complaints that included &#8220;The game is a cop killing simulator,&#8221; it may be that I&#8217;ve only played <i>San Andreas</i>, but I haven&#8217;t seen anything like &#8220;You can sleep with a prostitute and then beat her to get your money back&#8221; or &#8220;You can drive drunk, and it’s fun.&#8221; I&#8217;ve given rides to protitutes, taking them from job to job and prtecting them from violent clients, but if you <i>can</i> have sex with them in the game, it&#8217;s not immediately apparent how. And I can&#8217;t even begin to imagine how to drive drunk in the game. As far as partial nudity goes, I guess there was a nudie bar wear the girls wore bikinis&#8230; not that I can imagine how one might find videogame girls enticing&#8212;but we live in a very strange world, so anything&#8217;s possible I guess.<br />
________________________________________________</p>
<p>NOTES:<br />
*the little more that I see is related to visual interests.</p>
<p>**see Escapist Magazine’s <a href="http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_30/" rel="nofollow">thirtieth issue</a> for a decent treatment of this &#8211; and especially John Tynes’ <a href="http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_30/183-The-Contrarian-Masks-in-the-Woods" rel="nofollow">&#8220;Masks in the Woods.&#8221;</a></p>
<p>***not that I&#8217;m saying I am Awesome for being able to do this. It&#8217;s just something that comes with a lot of practice.</p>
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